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 IlliDon't be blaming the Republicans any more than the democrats. |
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Softie At the time, the Republicans wanted to cause our Government to give up the Full Faith and Credit of the United States, which would have had unthinkable consequences. Our country has had a National Debt since the Presidency of Andrew Jackson which has been backed by the Full Faith and Credit of the United States. It was the bright idea of this bunch of Republican politicians to default on those obligations to make their petty political points and to see what happens if you "press that button." It had never ever been considered as a political weapon prior to that time. As all ill-thought out ideas tend to do, this fiscal cliff might be the thing that breaks the Republican party as a political institution for all time. No one will consider voting for those morons for a generation if we get what they claim to want. Now they can play their little gotcha games when they make this train wreck happen, but I doubt they can pull it off. I suppose we shall see how much they can attempt to spin away their responsibility for what is down the road. |
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Illi Our national debt for all presidents up until George Bush was about $4 - 5 Trillion. George moved it to about $9 Trillion, in 8 years. BO has moved it up about another $6 - 7 Trillion in 4 years. Do you see the trend here? We can NOT spend like this. The big problem is debt service... we will not be able to pay the interest on the debt, let alone reduce it UNLESS we stop spending too much. THAT is what the Republicans want... reduce the spending. But, there is NO help from the Dems in that regard. If you know of any spending cut proposals, I'd like to hear them. |
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The Government did shut down during the Clinton Administration. It was a very unpopular thing at the time. But that is a whole different thing from defaulting on the debt of the United States, which would do lasting damage to the ability of the United States to borrow money in the future. It might make the currency collapse, hyperinflation...etc. The kind of stuff that brought Hitler to power. |
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Illi The debt and the debt servicing (paying back the principal and interest) are the problems. The deficit is the amount we add to the debt each year... it is not a problem in and of itself. We can't make our debt payments now without borrowing money. As we go over the fiscal cliff, we will get re-evaluated to a lower credit rating which will increase our interest rates, making it harder to service the debt. To resolve this, we need to lower spending and begin paying down the debt. Anything else is killing the nation. DM likes to say that you pay down the debt "in the good times". Well, THESE are the good times compared to what is coming unless we reduce spending and get a balanced budget. Can you imagine the largest economy in the world going four years without a budget? And worse, can you imagine any corporation going year after year with out a budget but knowing they were spending 50% more than they earned every year? This is economic foolishness at a peak. |
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These guys at FOX, Limbaugh, Hannity and the like have been more than happy to borrow, so long as they are slashing revenue. Revenue, in real terms is as low as it has ever been. (so is spending). You can check, but no one has ever worried about the National Debt. I remember as a teen and and young adult asking people about it, but the response was always "its so high, you don't even want to think about it." The deficit is the only thing we can control and the only thing we need to focus on. Revenue is where its at if you are serious about solving this problem. The Republicans have never been serious about the issue before. Sure, its been part of their platform for 50 years, which is exactly why you know they really don't give a damn about the problem. They just want back into power. |
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But, the national debt is the problem because we make payments on it each month (just like your house mortgage payment). If we refinance the house every month and spend that money on eating, movies, clothes, going to the doctor, gasoline etc. then each month our mortgage balance is higher and therefore our monthly payments are higher. If we refinance and the interest rates go up, we pay more in interest and our mortgage payments are higher. If our uncle were making those payments for us (nice uncle) we wouldn't notice or care about the increasing amount owed on the house or the size of the mortgage payment or the interest rate. We wouldn't even notice and it would be simply numbers. But if WE actually were making the payments, we would certainly notice. The American public does not know about, or care about, our debt or debt payments because they don't feel it... "they" are not making the payments. Their rich Uncle Sam is making them. (It's coming out of Baracks' stash) I think every person, family, household in the nation should be forced to write a check to the treasury each money for their share of the National Debt payment. Then we would notice and each month as it goes up, we would notice. |
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Let's (1) elevate the Medicare premium cap so the wealthy pay as much into the program as the poor and middle class; (2) elevate the trigger age for social security by a year; (3) cut defense spending by, say, 8-12%; (4) hire better auditors to assure less corruption and evasion. Doing these four things would absolutely solve all fiscal problems. It's so easy I don't understand why they don't do it. |
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chaz Actually I do agree with a lot of it, but I have some slight modifications. And, I do think there is more to it than that. But, a good start IF we can get them to do it. For example, I don't see cutting waste, fraud, and abuse from federal programs nor do I see cutting anything other than the military. While that proposal is good, we need to trim where the most advantage can be seen. |
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dmaestro 01-Dec-12, 10:56 |
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