chess online
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 Catholic Church v Obamacare?www.msnbc.msn.com |
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pretty fast! That money could go quite a long way somewhere else I'm sure. Perhaps the money is really used to defend priests. |
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this is not here is another point. some religions prohibit blood transfusions - would you support it if these groups said they will not pay for employee insurance that covers blood transfusions? christian scientists reject all medical interventions - would you support their right to not provide health insurance to their employees? |
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z decision that the employer (who is buying the insurance gets to decide). Not me, not you, and not the government. The benefits and perks of a job, along with salary... such as health care, eye care, dental care, vacation, and sick leave are all OPTIONAL paid by the employer. It is part of the entire package that an employer offers in order to hire and retain needed personnel. The employee and prospective employee have the entire freedom to accept the offer or reject the offer. That is what makes a free marketplace viable... the gives and takes, the negotiations, the freedom. It all comes down to supply and demand once again, doesn't it. Too many employees willing to accept the employment lowers package value. Too few employees willing to accept the package raises package value. On average and over time, the employer pays what he needs to pay and the employees gets the best deal they can... WITHOUT government intervention. |
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say mastuh can I get me a CAT-scan? that the good mastuh looks after the welfare of his house slaves and his field slaves carries over to the notion of the benevolent avuncular boss who has so transcended his unfortunate reputation of being a Scrooge or being a John D Rockefeller or being a Chicago packer who will call in the Pinkertons or the US Army to put down striking employees, but instead in the interests of efficient healthy workers does the very best he can to look out for them as a good uncle would or a father or a plantation owner -- and if you think That you should see the conditions in which the Father of his Country George Washington kept his slaves even at the main farm at Mount Vernon ; and if it is the government that "intervenes" for decent working conditions under the Civil Rights Act of 1964 or for decent health benefits -- guess what? in a land where it is Lincoln's "government of the people, for the people, and by the people," it is the people who are "intervening". |
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benevolent dictator, or living under an extreme socialistic government is that EVERYTHING is given to you. The thing that is bad about living in those environments is that you may not be given what you want, you may not be given what you need, and you may not be given very much of anything at all. The good thing about living in a Democracy where everybody is considered equal under the law, with equal rights and freedoms, and where the government considers individual liberties, freedoms and safeguards to be more important than majority, mob rule (or rule by one person or one party) is that everyone gets their fair say, their chance to decide on their leaders and representatives, and that they can expect to have a fair & equal opportunity to pursue their own individual happiness. The "bad thing" about living in that environment is that you might have to work for your happiness and nobody is expected to give it to you. |
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softy "everybody is considered equal under the law, with equal rights and freedoms, and where the government considers individual liberties, freedoms and safeguards to be more important than majority, mob rule (or rule by one person or one party) is that everyone gets their fair say, their chance to decide on their leaders and representatives, and that they can expect to have a fair & equal opportunity to pursue their own individual happiness." ...please let me know. |
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illi ... |
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<<[The bad thing is] you may not be given what you need, and you may not be given very much of anything at all. >> Those statements appear to be a bit...contradictory? Surely it's right-wing capitalism where you are not given what you need, or very much of anything? You can argue you are given the opportunity to have more, but you are not given the physicals things. Incidentally, I agree that the proposed system of mandating health insurance is a terrible idea. You're going to hand over even more money to the evil healthcare insurance companies, they must be absolutely delighted! It going to end up being a complete cartel. Obama has bottled on his promise to take them on and I really feel sorry for anyone here who will live under such a system. |
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z I have never said that any country (including the USA) is a utopia and I have never said that capitalism was the "be all, end all" of systems, nor is Democracy either. I have said that those things I wrote are, at least, enumerated in our Constitution and that, at least at one time, people believed in them enough to fight and die for them. They may not always have been practiced locally in reality, but they have been stated as goals and most people do still believe in them, and practice them. They are good goals and aspirations, don't you think? And, we do practice and enforce them, for the most part, don't you think? I have agreed that there is a role for government to play and important functions that it should perform. My complaint is that government does not do well anything anymore, does not do what it should be doing, does do things it should not be doing, and is "mucking up the works" such that a free enterprise capitalistic society (that has provided this country with the best standard of living in the history of the world) is now broke and disintegrating. |
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itchy |
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have you been listening to? |
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softy How can you be given everything, but not what you need? If you are not given what you need you are not given everything, by the very definition of everything! Please stop with these patronising one line answers to my questions. Dismiss me as a euro-socialist-lefty if you want (You would dismiss nearly any European in this way from your skewed vantage point!), but please don't treat me like a stupid child who is yet to understand how the world works, it's getting tiring. |
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The downside... treatment, because; men are certainly not equal. I'm not any more your equal than you are mine. My mind and my body are better suited to some things that yours are not, and visa versa. Some people are retarded while others are geniuses. Some folks are crippled while others are athletic. Some of us are beautiful while others of us are ugly. Concerning the above, we all have prejudices. That's where equality under the law comes in to play. The list above is small in comparison with our prejudices. One other is rich or poor. Why should those who are born rich get better tax breaks than those who are born into poverty? Why should they get a better interest rate on a loan? Why should folks who marry get a better tax rate than a single person? Equality, freedom, and other grand notions that are espoused in the U.S. and other countries are just talk. It is there that the measure of our littleness is measured by the OWS movement. The smallest of us deem them to be nothing more than rabble rousers. |
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itchy need you are not given everything, by the very definition of everything! " Sorry for being a little obtuse there... I try to be as direct as possible but I sometimes miss that mark and on second reading, I see your point. What I tried to say, and what I mean is that the "leadership" under those regimes will tell you, and give the impression that, they will "take care" of you from womb to tomb giving you all you want and need. The truth, however, is that you probably will NOT get what you want, what you need, or enough of the things they do give you. You certainly will only get what they want you to have. Your freedom of choice will be gone. "Please stop with these patronising one line answers to my questions. Dismiss me as a euro- socialist-lefty if you want (You would dismiss nearly any European in this way from your skewed vantage point!), but please don't treat me like a stupid child who is yet to understand how the world works, it's getting tiring." Sorry again... I had no intention of treating you like a stupid child. I was actually answering Shamash until you quizzed me and I used Cuba as the example for my reasoning, that I just explained. Really didn't mean to dismiss you as anything at all, either. |
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softy |
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