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The Truth?
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brigadecommander
05-Sep-12, 10:48

The Truth?
www.youtube.com
obsteve
05-Sep-12, 13:38

Haha
So what exactly is it about?

I really don't have the 5 hours viewing time to watch it multiple times in order to understand  
brigadecommander
05-Sep-12, 13:43

its about everything.
And its about 49-min long not 5hr. Its the cutting edge of Art, Philosophy,poetry and Science. I'm sorry you don't have the time. Maybe some day you will.I know you will like it.
obsteve
05-Sep-12, 14:05

I am interested in the concept
I tried to watch it but found it hazy after the 1st 10 minutes.

(It says at the start I will need to watch it several times before I get it, so that's 2 hrs 40 minumum!)

Any chance of a breakdown?
brigadecommander
05-Sep-12, 14:20

Reality is a difficult concept for all of us.
I'm afraid there is no simple answer here. Science is difficult. But i will say that if you try hard it could change your prospective in many subtle ways. Just spending hundreds of hours looking through my Telescope has changed mine. There are other ways also.Through Art and Philosophy one can change their view of the world. This video is about what truly is compared to what we think it is.....Others will disagree I'm sure. We are individuals after all.
obsteve
05-Sep-12, 15:03

I was intrigued that the commentary was disabled on the video. I can't find and peer reviews anywhere.

I'm tempted to say that if Athene has a theory he should publish it  

There is some commentary here, which I found useful

www.reddit.com
brigadecommander
05-Sep-12, 16:09

a theory is a theory
nothing more. How the brain works is not. But thought provoking it is. And that's why i posted it. If you notice there is a question mark in the first post. Knowing what i know about molecular Biology this presentation is not far off the mark. I would imagine most people will not like it. What is not understood frightens Humans. This is discussed in the video.
obsteve
06-Sep-12, 00:40

Hi Commander,

I hope I'm not alone in feeling that the monotonous monologe with the gratuitous graphics actually obscure any message!

I would much prefer a written paper, tbh, without the spin  

There is also this commentary on JREF, which I found useful:

forums.randi.org

"First Corollary: If it's announced on Youtube, it's not a scientific breakthrough.

Second Corollary: No, we're not going to watch a 48 minute video. "

LOL, I am such a skeptic  
brigadecommander
06-Sep-12, 08:26

actually...
i have received many compliments and thanks for this video. They watched it all the way through several times. Each time they understood it a little better. I'm sorry if it was monotonous to you. I did not post it as a 'scientific breakthrough' as it is not. These facts have been around a long time. I mealy posted it to give an idea of the complexity of the 'Human' mind and the correlation to its physical environment, not as a 'fast food video about the rolling stones'.I would think that the audience for this type of material is a lot more intelligent then you suggest!!. Be well...J
obsteve
06-Sep-12, 15:00

Hi J,

Yeah, I have little patience with ubergraphics and underscore when I'm trying to pay attention to something scientific. I have a big bugbear about when they do it on the news and on science programs... endless, repeated, meaningless visuals, yuck... You and I know that this is actually the fast food- serves no purpose other than as a filler. Patronising to audiences, IMO

I guess I was just a little let down, as it was billed as "the truth?" and as a "theory of everything", neither being the case.

So if it is anything more than the self-aggrandising, obfuscating piece of puffery I took it for, what is the content?

Could you describe the central arguments for me, please?

brigadecommander
06-Sep-12, 15:26

i will not explain what has been explained already
it is a simple video and explains itself. You don't like it. Fine.That's your right. Lets move on. Any further dialogue on this matter seems designed only for the sake of argument. I have no problem with your dislike of this video. Please respect my advocacy of it. Thank you Sir.....Janet....PS; I am a student of Micro-biology. And have no problem Understanding these concepts. If you wish to further your education take some courses in advanced Physics and Neural Biology. This will clarify things for you.
shamash
06-Sep-12, 15:27

both provocative and comforting
Well, from its early insights on the danger of labeling
to its closing points on the power in seeing patterns --
all of which are communicated clearly, straightforwardly, and cohesively --
I find this brilliant, enlightening, engaging, and -- comforting.
obsteve
06-Sep-12, 15:36

Hi J, coincidentally my brother did his doctorate in microbiology   I enlist his help when I get a whiff of pseudoscience. He is very helpful

Here's a pretty damning analysis of the video for you:

"Neural part: makes sense, but I'd ask an actual neuroscientist about the details. I do agree with the conclusions, even though the end is more speculation than scientific fact. It's logical speculation, unlike pretty much any other theory.

Quantum part: very good review of modern physics, up to the "De Broglie's equation" part... C = hf is nonsense. The actual equation is E = hf, E being energy; this is just a statement that a quantum particle of energy E has an oscillatory frequency f. It does NOT say anything about consciousness. (incidentally, this is not de Broglie's equation; it's just a definition of Planck's constant). After some very unclear babble about meson oscillation and C and anti C, he does get back on track (saying that everything has an "anti" thing is very misleading. Even if the theory allows for it, this doesn't mean it's actually there).

Theory of Everything : "the reference frame is a quantum" makes no sense. Also, using the photon as a frame of reference is a very bad idea. Every number is mapped to zero and cannot be mapped back; every calculation becomes 0 = 0. Pretty useless... Also, the arrow of time has nothing to do with Heisenberg's uncertainty principle, as claimed. The latter can be derived from the wave/particle duality and a bit of math.

"accelerated relative to the arrow of time". What?? the C's cancel each other? The speeds of light? With 12 minutes left he's just just making sh** up.

b) Infinite probabilities? Really now? And what's with C standing for every single variable? What's wrong with other letters?

c) Time is orthogonal to space. It is indeed made of the same fabric. It is not in any sense the "opposite". The opposite of "north" is "south", it's not "backwards in time" I really don't see what he's getting at here...

This all started out very well, but turned into a bit of a train wreck at the end. It's hard to figure out which parts are his pal's "new theory of everything" and which parts are just badly interpreted physics. It's possible that he just ran out of time and decided only to read every third sentence...

All in all, a good review up until about halfway through the physics part. Then it gets confused. In any case the ultimate test of a theory is not that we let go of our prejudices, or even that we all understand it: it's that it makes solid mathematical predictions of actual physical experiments, and doesn't contain any logical contradictions.

I hope this helps"

I hear this Athene guy puts a lot of time and effort into trolling. I reckon you bin trolled...

brigadecommander
06-Sep-12, 15:44

i reckon not
My Brother 'is' a micro-biologist also and works at NASA. He designed and helped design the instruments now being used on the surface of Mars in the Curiosity rover. He thinks the video is very accurate and useful, so i will defer to him. Your points have been noted. Lets move on.
obsteve
06-Sep-12, 15:55

Cool, I would love to know what he says  

I think you out-trumped my on brothers there  

My big bro took his family out to see the last shuttle launch, said it was the best day of his life. I turn to him on all matters mathematical, scientific and computery

My little bro is the musical one of the family, and also the psychologist among us. He gets all the social/psychological questions I have.

I have another brother (from another mother) who is the sporty one, and ran with the olympic torch this year

I am the arty farty one...



brigadecommander
06-Sep-12, 16:02

you don't sound farty
you seem inquisitive. I have 4-brothers and 3-sisters. My Dad was married three times.I am the youngest and last. That's fabulous about the Olympic torch!!! You must be very proud. I am up to my ears with papers and a huge work load. I have signed on to go to the great barrier reef this spring to begin my Masters (in Biology not physics). Then maybe someday work for NASA.
obsteve
07-Sep-12, 16:00

Aye I am very proud (thoughb in fairness there were many runners) V jealous about the gb reef expedition. You have a thesis ready, or you waiting til you get out there?



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