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| chris21 12/22/2002 10:29:43 [ report this post ] |
 Subject: Openings question?Message: I bought a book recently which seems to name some openings according to how both white, and black play. Example- 1.e4 e5 2. Nc3... is the Vienna game. Now, my question is as long as I play e4 followed by Nc3 have I played the vienna game opening, or is it important for black to have moves e5 on his first move? I just give this opening as an example there's countless others. So, would 1e4 e6 2.Nc3 still be the Vienna game? I know some openings have a name regardless of how black responds e.g the sicillian dragon, but I'm curious as to why my book of openings names blacks responses when referring to an opening by white? Hope this makes sense, thanks in advance:) |
| philaretus 12/22/2002 10:43:07 [ report this post ] | chris21 Message: You've played the Vienna Game if you reach the definitive position in any order. For instance, After 1.e4 Nf6 (so far Petrov's Defence), White sometimes chickens out with 2.Nc3. If Black continues 2...e5, then the Vienna Game has been reached by transposition. The example you cite would certainly not be a Vienna Game: it will most probably end up as a French Defence. |
| chris21 12/22/2002 11:05:25 [ report this post ] | Message: I thought 1.e4 Nf6 would be the Alekhine defence? Isn't the Petroff defense 1.e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nf6? |
| philaretus 12/22/2002 15:27:13 [ report this post ] | Ooops! Message: For Petrov read Alekhine! |
| the_disiple 12/22/2002 18:19:57 [ report this post ] | sicillian dragon Message: the sicillian dragon depends on how both black and white play... if white plays e4 and then black plays e5, it's not the sicillian defence thus not the sicillian/dragon variation. same with 1.e4 c5 2.Nc3 e6 not dragon. openings depend on how both sides start out |
| chris21 12/23/2002 02:16:57 [ report this post ] | The Disciple Message: Yes but as long as the required moves are made by black then the dragon will be reached. Where as for example 1...Nf6 for black can't be the start of the kings indian defense for black if white has played 1e4 and not 1.d4. |
| philaretus 12/23/2002 06:17:08 [ report this post ] | In printed scores.... Message: .....of games, such openings are often signalled by some such phrase as: "French Defence (by transposition)". One of the most curious is 1. f4 (Bird's Opening) e5 (From's Gambit) 2. e4 (King's Gambit by transposition). |
| atrifix 12/23/2002 11:24:50 [ report this post ] | KID by 1. e4 Nf6 Message: 1. e4 Nf6 2. f3 d6 3. d4 g6 4. c4 Bg7 5. Nc3. |
| nimzoredivivus 12/24/2002 20:53:08 [ report this post ] | The naming of openings... Message: ...is after a fashion arbitrary. One must learn the initial position that characterizes the opening so named. For example, the Bird's to King's Gambit transposition. The name of the opening gives way to the King's Gambit in part because the King's Gambit is older. On the other hand, many positions in the Vienna Game should really be called the Bishop's Opening because it is older -- but are often called the Vienna because it is more known! Then you have 1.b3 and 1.Nf3, 2. b3. What is it? White plays b3 on move one or move two. Some call it the Queen Fianchetto, some the Nimzowitsch Attack, some the Nimzo-Larsen Attack, and some the Larsen Opening. Some call 1.b3 the Larsen Opening and some 1.Nf3 2.b3 the Nimzowitsch Attack. Go figure! it is all essentially the same opening! Convention is more or less the rule of the day. 1.e4 e6 is the French and 1.e4 c6 is the Caro-Kann and 1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 is the Vienna. Those are accepted names for those positions -- unless they transpose to something else! |
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