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GameKnot related: Timeout Suggestion, Amnesty ?!?
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baronderkilt
15-Oct-10, 22:21

Timeout Suggestion, Amnesty ?!?
Hi All ... I was wondering what you would think of this: What about dropping TimeOuts off of a players record, so to speak, off of the TimeOut Percentage after a certain amount of time? I was thinking maybe 2 or 3 years.

Those old TimeOuts really don't say much anymore. A player has made a whole new Record.
Likely it stayed stay pretty much the same percentage if that is just how they play, & they made no changes.

But they may have a completely spotless record for those two or three years, if their original Timeouts were due to some emergency/ies. Then they probably represent a one or two time catastrophe. And many of those may have even been before the present protection of Emergency Postponement was added. (As in my case most were on two occasions, both before that feature was added).

It just seems to me that: 1) Revising it to a couple years will me more reflective of their present play habits. And 2) It is good for players to feel they get a second chance to do better about TimeOuts. For instance, they might become eligible for some of the teams that they are not now. And just the spirit of the thing. Maybe most of their timeouts were early in their GK experience, when they did not yet know the etiquette or importance involved.

What do other players think of this idea ?!
1) Second Chance
2) "Off with their heads, and put em on The-Rack; I don't care what order ... "
or 3) Other ... ( Please Feel free to elaborate, we can always rack you later )  

* * * * * * * * *
}8-) the Baron
yanm
16-Oct-10, 00:42

Good idea milord
I had a single timeout five years ago and the thing is still marring my profile...

Maybe the best idea is to bring the timeout statistic under the "Past 90 days," "Past year," "All rated games"
area? Thinking of it, all statistics could be brought under this umbrella...
yanm
16-Oct-10, 00:55

Speaking of meaningless statistics
In my "All rated games", it shows that I won against a 2075-rated player... but it was a time out. I would also
like this statistic to disappear as it does not tell anything real.
black_cat_hamlet
16-Oct-10, 04:46

My profile...
Has 82 Timeouts, making up 11% of my games... doesn't really look too good, does it? lol...

That's a long time ago though - to be honest, I don't really mind either way but having the old Timeouts abolished doesn't sound like a bad idea (probably not a high priority tho)
algol
16-Oct-10, 06:55

...
Good proposal baronderkilt.
Also agree with yanm, a win because of time out should not really be retained as best performance...
maca
16-Oct-10, 07:39

...
I'm also inclined to think that this is a good idea, but I think it would be even better if the timeout statistics were brought under the "Past 90 days", "Past year" and "All rated games" classification.


Regards,
MaCa.
kingdawar
16-Oct-10, 09:34

The total timeouts statistic is a good measure of general reliability. Everyone has their list of excuses for the occurrence and how this will never happen again. In my experience as a GK player/team captain, the circumstances WILL happen again and the person will again drop out of games he initiated. What I currently don't like about the % is that it is kind of misleading. For example baronderkilt's timeout percentage is 16 in 118 games which leads to a percentage of 13%. But actually 16 of 34 losses are by timeout - it should show 47% instead. Right?
tag1153
16-Oct-10, 11:15

hmmm......
My profile is loaded with meaningless statistics. The one that I have taken the most pride in, though, is not ever having timed out of a game. I have come close over the years, but have always found a way to make my moves in the agreed upon time control. So, in a rare instance of disagreement with my good friend baronderkilt, I say "No Amnesty!". I have spent the past six or so years compiling a record, and I don't want to see it go the way of the whole mini-tournament points thing (don't get me started). As I have stated in the past, I'm all for change and new features, etc...Just don't let progress erase the years of effort some players put into certain categories (ironbutterfly comes to mind).

oldschool
tactical_abyss
16-Oct-10, 15:34

If I was jumping out of a plane at 8000 feet and my parachute and back up chute failed,i'd still make sure that I made my GK chess move from my cell phone before I hit!Or atleast have the decency to resign and not keep my opponents waiting!No time-outs for me.No guarantee for the next move,however,unless I hit a mattress factory with an open roof and a mile high stack of mattresses!

All kidding aside,I do believe that after,say a certain length of time...perhaps a 2 year period,that the time-out stats should be reset as has been suggested above.
baronderkilt
17-Oct-10, 12:40

If one wants to examine my losses
They will probably find that about 8 of a dozenish resignations made early on were nonlost positions, but I did get them resigned rather than timing out. And several have actually been fully won positions, ie up a piece, etc. And I think some of the timeouts would prove to be nonlosing as well, considering that they just happened and due to life situations and nothing to do with what was on the board.

Still and all, I have always felt that a loss is a loss a win is a win regardless of how that comes about, and am the first to tell others that. As HK points out, my reliability is not high, precisely why I do not play team games. And one could wonder if there might not be Some reason for that or the fact my rating is hundreds of points lower than in past days. Hmmm it Could make one think ... if one is inclined to thinking, of course. lol

But in the end, the fact is that i no longer give a "hoot" what my rating might be here, since I discovered during my first provisional games here that passing out to a health issue while one's very fingers are upon the mouse to move, and losing two games to time out there upon, is not conductive to making any effort toward a serious attempt at virtuosity, and conducting things accordingly since then.

This however, is quite alright for three reasons. I do not and have never based my self-concept upon the results of Chess or any game. (And hope that others do not judge me, themselves, or others, by such a Chimera) It does not equate to even intellect, let alone ones worth. (2) I put forth this suggestion on behalf of others, not myself ... who have absolutely no aspirations here (or few other places for that matter, indeed I have done whatever it is I will do in this Life , and now find my joy in the joy of others, as they embark upon their path and find their victories as they come, in whatever form or venue.).
And (3) It does Not Matter
kingdawar
17-Oct-10, 12:43

Did you just resort to the existential "does it matter" argument here, BDK?  
baronderkilt
17-Oct-10, 12:50

PS//
In view of remarks from Tag and others, I think I agree that putting it into a form of 90/days, 1 Year/ Lifetime/ or such must be the best form of my concept re timouts. Indeed it Would be very unfair to make the effort of tag and those who have done so exceptionally well, to just Disappear. That would be worse than leaving things as they are.

Especially after seeing mini/T efforts go that way, etc. I modify my suggestion accordingly !
baronderkilt
17-Oct-10, 13:18

Heinkat
If I Did ... It does not Matter }8-D
lighttotheright
20-Oct-10, 07:00

Add another couple of statistics instead of providing amnesty -- number and percentage of timeouts over the last 2 years. If amnesty at all, it should be given only after an additional 200 games without another timeout. If you are going to provide any kind of amnesty, it should only be done according to number of additional games...not time period. What that number should be is open to debate.

Yes, it would give a better perspective on the players current habits. Deleting the history entirely would give a false impression to other players. Deletion would simply be wrong. It would also give a false impression of those who never have timed out, period. But the new stats would provide a better picture at a glance for those uninspired to do a little research on their potential opponent. Such stats might serve a useful purpose and might quell some of the angst concerning the status quo.

For me, large numbers of timeouts from my opponent does not matter unless they occurred recently. That's because their rating is probably artificially too low to play them in a fair game. Typically when someone timeouts they have a huge series of them and their rating has fallen 200 to 400 points. I've also seen some that have fallen in excess of 600 points.

But if they have played an additional 30 to 50 or so games without any more timeouts, the disparity should no longer significant as long as they play normally.
drandall
21-Jan-11, 17:31

Agree Completely
I agree completely. I have too many timeouts on my record, and I'm ashamed and regretful for
the mistakes, but I have made efforts to correct my behavior and play games that I can commit
to. It's overwhelming now to know that I could be perfect for a year and still have a terrible
record. I think the best and most fair solution would be to put it in the 90 days/1 year/entire
history area. This way at least it is possible to change your behavior and be rewarded for it. I
feel that it would provide more motivation to change. As it stands now it's hard to overcome the
feeling that more timeouts don't really matter because it doesn't make my record look any worse.
That's definitely a negative thing.
kingdawar
21-Jan-11, 18:12

100 timeouts now? Chances are you'll timeout again, just from what I've seen as team captain/normal user of this site
alphadelta
22-Jan-11, 02:54

My opinion of time-outs is that they are far too open to abuse. My preference would be to start the clock at the beginning of a game and allow no changes to it - none. No vacation flags, no postponements, nothing. When the time's up, it's up... end of story.