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From	Message
saintinsanity 05-Jul-16, 18:00	I'd say a good percentage of Bernie supporters weren't able to vote last election. They just got their first message that nothing they want matters.
saintinsanity 05-Jul-16, 18:02	I completely agree. Despite the horror I feel when I imagine more Clintons or Bushs, I would take a victory for women any day, despite the fact that she has nothing to do with furthering women's rights. Just the fact that a woman wins will have to be good enough. So pathetic.
proginoskes 05-Jul-16, 18:58	Looks political and partisan from where I'm sitting but I never expected any charges. I think anyone who did was naive. Though a thoughtful question to ask is if you did what age did or similar at your job would you be promoted or fired? The question is rhetorical and needs not an answer. Fantastic choices for president America. Bang. Up. Job. Ugh.
ace-of-aces 05-Jul-16, 19:34	Extremely careless but HRC had no intention of breaking the law. Therefore, she should not be charged. I gave you the example that I got a speeding ticket. Could I argue with the police officer that I did not deserve a ticket for making a simple mistake because I was not aware of the speed limit sign? According to my experience in real life situation like that I cannot get away with that excuse but HRC does. This can happen if you believe in Murphy's law. My next question is, " Will the people vote for an extreme careless person to become the US president ? " The answer is yes, because as long as she can do what the people want her to do and not what is right thing to do. A lot of people on welfare and entitlement will vote for her so that they can continue receiving their entitlement. As long as US can borrow or print money, she can count on their votes. They don't care what she is.
chaz- 05-Jul-16, 19:35	... AND because she is much less a threat to the country than Trump is.
ace-of-aces 05-Jul-16, 19:42	chaz is right. Depending on your point of view, people will vote the lesser of the evil. We don't have much choice now. It is between HRC and Trump.
chaz- 05-Jul-16, 19:47	... both HRC and Trump are critique-able, that's for sure. But, I also think HRC was better than most (all?) of the other GOP wannabes ... and Bernie was an idealist (his timing was off). I'm disappointed we don't have a "neutral" unifier-type candidate (I don't care from which party) who could embrace "divisiveness" as the critical core issue ... and NOT the party preconceived agendas that keep pitting us against each other. But I'm naive to believe this is possible anymore.
lord_shiva 05-Jul-16, 20:09	Ace Analogy If someone emailed you six kilos of cocain, should you be arrested and sent to prison? What if you made a convincing case to the FBI you did not know the person emailing you the drugs, or that pharmaceutical cocaine is routinely mailed to your drug store, but these six kilos were sent o your home by mistake? How many years should you serve in prison for that crime? Despite all the patients who received the needed medications just fine, and no drugs you received ever found their way into the hands of drug dealers?
chaz- 05-Jul-16, 20:12	Lord S... ... how quickly were the police notified after receiving the "shipment"? Or, was reporting this immaterial?
lord_shiva 05-Jul-16, 20:19	Pseudo ephedrine So Hillary gets tons of legal OTC drugs mailed to her, plus 101 capsules of prescription pain relievers. Instead of sending those potent drugs back by registered mail, she uses a common carrier. While rules were broken, none of these drugs ended up on the street. How many years in prison should Hillary serve because the pharmaceutical company used her home address 52 out of the thirty thousand times? If your pharmacist realized this was a problem and took corrective measures, how many years in prison should he be forced to serve?
lord_shiva 05-Jul-16, 20:22	Glenda was from the South. The GOP dropped a house on the wicked witch of the East, Carly F.
lord_shiva 05-Jul-16, 20:31	Chaz Two years later the FBI discovers there had been misshipments, none of which they can show fell into the wrong hands, or had been mishandled with any criminal intent. Speeding is driving without paying attention. But receiving a shipment at the wrong address, that is negligent, but the FBI determined it makes no sense to prosecute this as a crime, especially as the previous pharmacists had been much more lax and the current drug czar eventually fixed systemic issues. I ordered something for a friend once, and my next order defaulted to his credit card. A horrible, horrible mistake, and one for which my more conservative friends concur I should have spent six years in prison over.
chaz- 05-Jul-16, 23:05	OK OK
ace-of-aces 06-Jul-16, 07:37	paying no (or lack of) attention versus negligence LS thanks for your explanation but chaz should not ok it because I don't see any difference between the two. For example, a lot of accidents happen when drivers try to beat the red stop light at the intersection. It happened in front of my eyes. The traffic light was turning yellow and so I slowed down and stopped but the car behind me, overtook me and went ahead at the intersection. His car hit the other car who was also racing and trying to turn. There was head on collision with lot of damage. I don't know the details of LS's story of drug shipment to the wrong address. In real life, there are many stories of doctor's and pharmacists pushing drugs into the streets. Luckily, the drugs were not sent into the wrong hands. We have to individualize and analyze on its own merits. Let me give you another example. A diabetic patient has a very bad gangrene in his right leg which needs amputation. Instead the surgeon amputates the left leg. Is this negligence or lack of attention by the surgeon ? I believe it is both. Having said that let us review HRC's email scandal. She handled thousands of state emails for 4 years on her when she was secretary of state. She denied that none of them were classified or she did not know that they were classified. FBI found out that 110 of her emails were classified. LS is a computer expert and can easily find the truth. Her story cannot convince even a dummy like me. IMHO, she is lying.
proginoskes 06-Jul-16, 07:56	Here is what Comey said about all of this: 1. He concluded Hillary was “extremely careless” in handling our nation’s secrets. 2. He admitted no reasonable person could have believed putting these emails on a private server was at all appropriate or acceptable. 3. He admitted 110 emails on the server were classified at the time they were sent 4. He admitted Hillary deleted work-related emails before turning them over to the State Department, despite her claims otherwise. 5. He admitted it’s likely foreign governments hacked her emails — and our adversaries could know critical secrets about the U.S. government because of Hillary’s actions. None of that sounds good. Or what any of us would want in a President.
ace-of-aces 06-Jul-16, 09:00	Why Bernie Sanders is still in the presidential race ? Now, it is clear. When Trey Gowdey gloated with glee about the Benghazi findings that HRC was negligent in handling of the case that resulted in the death of 4 Americans including an ambassador, he was expecting a knock out blow for HRC. Instead it was a child's play for HRC. All she can say was, " Hey folks, let's move on." Her polls are still intact and ahead of Trump. Now she is confronting the last but not the least, email scandal. She was confident that she would come out unscathed out of this email scandal when FBI director Comey announced that although she was careless, it was nonsense. So, she is campaigning happily like a honeymoon couple with Obama using Air Force one which may be better than Trump's private jet and save some money for her travel expense. I can imagine it will be very irritating to GOP establishment like you put a salt on the earthworm wrigglers. This is also good for Trump because this incident becomes a rallying point of GOPs which were divided before to support Trump. Not to be outdone by HRC, they are now developing a scheme to counteract her ploy. The American politics appear nasty but we have to accept the way it is. The outcome is still unclear. The jury is still out there. There is a remote possibility that HRC might be prosecuted and barred from presidential race. There will be no problem if she is out of the race. HRC fans will have a very honest and credible man, Bernie Sanders who never wavers from his convictions as replacement for HRC but I am not sure he can beat Trump.
lord_shiva 06-Jul-16, 09:03	Likely vs. Possible 1. Agreed, the email handling was careless, even if the private server was more secure. The route to that server would not have been. 2. Putting the email on a private server was inappropriate for classified email. In an abundance of caution state classifies a great many things. In their effort to combat transparency the Bush administration reclassified much that had been released. Even the White House guest list got classified. No classified material originated on Hillary's server, it was sent to her by others who were careless. Hillary's carelessness was in not halting that. 3. 110 out of sixty thousand. 4. Hillary herself did not delete these emails. Instead, they were deleted by staffers for not being recognized as work related. Again, no pattern of willful misconduct was discerned in this. My wife sometimes emails shopping lists to my work address. I don't have a cow over it. 5. Bear in mind, much of what gets classified is only politically embarrassing, not dangerous. Eight of the messages were top secret, meaning their interception would be harmful to the nation, not simply damaging to one political faction. He did not claim it was likely her server had been hacked--they found no evidence of that. It was extremely careless these eight messages ended up on her private server. They should have been scrubbed, and the authors of those messages reprimanded. But still, this has been quite a mountain raised out of the Benghazi mole hill. 52 chains, meaning 52 pieces of classified information. No NOC lists, nothing of that nature. But eight messages (I know not the chain count--possibly four) bearing top secret content. THAT is unconscionable, but still ranks lower than Libby Scooter taking the fall for outing a covert agent in retaliation against Bush's political enemies. Conservatives dismissed that as a non issue, as hardly anyone was killed over it--and none were American.
brigadecommander 06-Jul-16, 09:08	prog.;I want her FOR PRESIDENT. Don't speak for me. And he did not say foreign governments 'hacked' her e-mail. He said it is 'possible' they could have. Overall she was a great Secretary of State. And she will make a great President.GWB lied to the Country and was responsible for Hundreds of thousands of lives being lost,Trillions in treasure squandered, and you point to this stupid e-mail scandal as if it were of real importance.
dmaestro 06-Jul-16, 09:09	While Prog states valid concerns I do not see it as he does. I think she rightly knew the right wing was after her but let that drive very bad judgement in trying to keep them out of her private business without realizing her solution was worse. I believe as President she will comply with the laws and will not face an underfunded and inferior IT system like at State. She will be under constant attention. So I think it is not indicative of how she will be as President.
proginoskes 06-Jul-16, 09:15	BC My apologies. I probably did assume too much when I figured most of us would want someone who has demonstrated competence and not the opposite. And then lied about it. I'm not sure how Bush is relevant other than he makes my point nicely about competence and lying.
proginoskes 06-Jul-16, 09:16	DM Can you guys still maybe figure out a way to get Biden in there for candidacy? I'd really like someone, anyone, on the ballot I can vote for.
pecosbill 06-Jul-16, 10:24	Hillary is far from off the hook legally 1) Hillary will be indicted on espionage charges (as well as the additional crimes noted below) if Trump wins.... on that you can be sure! 2) Nothing has yet been said about the public corruption probe: "EXCLUSIVE: The FBI investigation into Hillary Clinton’s use of private email as secretary of state has expanded to look at whether the possible “intersection” of Clinton Foundation work and State Department business may have violated public corruption laws, three intelligence sources not authorized to speak on the record told Fox News. This new investigative track is in addition to the focus on classified material found on Clinton’s personal server. 'The agents are investigating the possible intersection of Clinton Foundation donations, the dispensation of State Department contracts and whether regular processes were followed,' one source said." www.foxnews.com 3) A perjury indictment is still possible, although not likely given the Obama administrations track record: "Secretary of State Hillary Clinton testified under oath before the House Select Committee on Benghazi last October that she had turned over “all my work related emails” from her private email server to the State Department. But on Tuesday, FBI director James Comey revealed that the agency had found “several thousand” work-related emails Clinton had not turned over, including three that included information that had been classified at the time that they had been sent." www.breitbart.com
zorroloco 06-Jul-16, 11:49	Bill Keep dreaming
popedonald01 06-Jul-16, 11:52	Hillary Loses - Big Time If criminal charges were filed, Hillary the candidate would be no more, probably. Now the Dems will stick with her, and she is even more damaged than before. After all, the F.B.I. so much as said what the more informed crowd already knew, that Hillary is such a moron, that she is dangerous. Now the low info crowd will digest, one would hope, the F.B.I. report.
chaz- 06-Jul-16, 11:54	... I understand there will be many who do not like HRC, or even Bill for that matter ... and they do not embrace a Left-leaning agenda either. They WANT to vote for a more conservative candidate, and they want established values to remain in place. ... I understand there will be many who do not like Trump and despise his mannerisms, hate-speech, ethnic lambasting, etc. They WANT to vote for a more traditionally liberal candidate, someone who embraces progressive change. Albeit not a perfect world, help me to understand how the vehemence and passion against HRC's acts of omission or negligence or carelessness comes even close to the divisiveness and absence of competence on Trump's part. We have much to be thankful for in this country. I don't understand the role of the dice with someone who has proved he's only into things for his own self aggrandizement. HRC's decades of experience are bound to have inconsistencies. But, it's somehow OK for Trump not even to disclose his tax returns (etc.). I just don't understand it.
softaire 06-Jul-16, 12:18	Prog Not only all that but because the emails (with top secret information was hacked) the moment she steps into office, she will be black-mailed. She will be held hostage to the blackmailers and there is no telling what she will give away then.
proginoskes 06-Jul-16, 12:19	Chaz Exactly. Draft Biden. Call an audible. Something.
zorroloco 06-Jul-16, 12:23	Deleted by zorroloco on 06-Jul-16, 12:23.
proginoskes 06-Jul-16, 12:28	Softy That is a concern. Also one of a very practical nature.
ace-of-aces 06-Jul-16, 13:01	More than carelessness. This is corruption. youtu.be www.amazon.com I worked at the VA hospital before. Patient confidentiality (HIPPA) rule is very strict. Once you enter the patient's information and sign it, you cannot change the information later. You have to put the new information in the addendum. It also becomes the permanent record and cannot be deleted. This is not so with HRC's private emails. She deleted about 30,000 of her emails prior to FBI investigation. She could do it because she claimed that those were her private emails. I believe she is hiding something similar to president Nixon who deleted some portions of the White House tapes in Watergate scandal but Nixon failed to delete everything related to Watergate scandal and was caught cheating. The two situations are similar. FBI caught her with 110 classified emails. FBI investigations did not include corruption probe. FBI should dig in to see whether there is any corruption involved. I am sure there will be. The book in the link above is, " Clinton Clash " which showed how corrupt they are. Even if you don't believe it read the book with a grain of salt and then you will understand why she was using her private server to enrich themselves. ------------------------ In 2000, Bill and Hillary Clinton owed millions of dollars in legal debt. Since then, they’ve earned over $230 million. Where did the money come from? Most people assume that the Clintons amassed their wealth through lucrative book deals and high-six figure fees for speaking gigs. Now, Peter Schweizer shows who is really behind those enormous payments. In the New York Times bestseller Clinton Cash, he follows the Clinton money trail, revealing the connection between their personal fortune, their “close personal friends,” the Clinton Foundation, foreign nations, and some of the highest ranks of government. Now, with Hillary on the verge of winning the presidential nomination, the questions it raises are more important than ever. Schweizer reveals the Clintons’ troubling dealings in Kazakhstan, Colombia, Haiti, and other places at the “wild west” fringe of the global economy. In this blockbuster exposé, Schweizer merely presents the troubling facts he’s uncovered. Meticulously researched and scrupulously sourced, filled with headline-making revelations, Clinton Cash raises serious questions of judgment, of possible indebtedness to an array of foreign interests, and ultimately, of fitness for high public office. A new documentary to be released will continue to push the revelations in Clinton Cash.
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