GameKnot: GameKnot related, Gameknot Better Less Accounts Blocked for Silly Reasons!!?

GameKnot related: Gameknot Better Less Accounts Blocked for Silly Reasons!!?

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luzhin657
25-Jun-24, 20:02

Gameknot Better Less Accounts Blocked for Silly Reasons!!?

I have only been on Gameknot for short time, about 3 months I was on Chess.com and looked elsewhere because almost every week you would see some poor account holder had his or her account frozen or 🚫 blocked due to the silliest of reasons. One guy would have his account blocked because Chess.com accused him of using assistance because he always played his first 12 or so moves 100% accurate, when challenged he admitted using his ECO opening book on opening phase of his games so they Froze his account? Another guy had his account Frozen because he abandoned all challenges for 2 months, it was silly at times so I stopped playing on there. Now I only on Gameknot and SchemingMind.com Be interesting to here from others of there experiences on these other Chess playing sites.

laurent_baptiste
07-Aug-24, 02:20

Did he do it in Live chess at chess.com?
Using any assistance on Live chess is considered cheating. So if he admitted to using an opening book, he admitted to cheating.

They also punish accounts constantly abandoning games in Live chess. Why can he not resign like any normal person? In my opinion if it took 2 months to get him banned for it, they were incredibly lax.

euro_pop_legend
29-Dec-24, 16:16

Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 29-Dec-24, 16:31.

euro_pop_legend
29-Dec-24, 16:31

I am not familiar with all the chess sites anymore,even though I was a member of about 10 of them,dating back to the 1980's,most gone by now.Perhaps the rules have changed over the years.But I have also played online with the USCF tourneys as well as USCF postal chess in the old days.In all my experiences,even admitting to using an opening book,either paperback or something like the GK opening book was NEVER wrong and it WAS/IS allowed legally to use.
No,not OTB,but corresp chess in my experiences had always allowed it,for no one can tell who
is holding a book on his/her table.

Even "admitting"to using an opening book is NOT wrong and not wrong on GK either.
If that is different on live chess with chess.com I can see that as being TRUE,but only if it is live with standard time controls like 40/2.But 2-3 day move corresp games are ok in all my experiences and even admitting to using ANY opening book on the market.The player on chess.com,in other words,should have NOT used any opening book if it was not allowed and
of course,admitting to using a book only compounded his problems.My guess is that the player in question was simply use to standard C.C.rules that DO permit opening books to be used.
It can get confusing to those who do not keep up with all the rules.I have no plans to ever join chess.com,so its a moot point to me.As a life member of the USCF as well as a life member of GK,that enough for me!

As to luzhin657,seems like he left GK permanently,even though he had only good things to say about GK as one of his two best chess sites.Fascinating.

Guess what opening book "I"use most of the time and a book that many GM's use.
Does anyone know?I will come back sometime and let you know!Hint: Its NOT GK's
opening book.....far from it!

chilliman64
21-Jan-25, 21:45

MCO? FCO? Nunn's?

laurent_baptiste
22-Jan-25, 00:47

It's not allowed to use opening books nor databases in live chess time controls in chess.com. Any outside assistance is forbidden.
So if anyone admits to using them, they are basically admitting cheating, and it's as bad as saying you are using Stockfish to play your first 12 moves.

The rules for Daily time controls are very similar to this site's, so they are allowed there.

euro_pop_legend
22-Jan-25, 05:41

@chilliman64

In answer to your question,I do use MCO,FCO and Nunn's,however,I mainly use two other books....Hiarcs and a custom "polyglot"book that is cutting edge actually designed for me by a GM friend of mine and an IM.The book isolates only the highest statistical win ratio's with specific openings and opening defenses.The GM's have similar study "tools",including Hiarcs.

Hiarcs can be downloaded by anyone with a good UCI compatible GUI.
Except for older versions,however,it is not free,but worth the $$.
So,Hiarcs is not a paperback,but only downloaded onto your computer.

As mentioned above,it appears that on chess.com opening books cannot be used legally.
But again,that is NOT the case on GK and other chess sites.That is easy to see,since GK's
opening book is "right there"to look at,even in a seperate window and right alongside of
your game.Of course,as it has been for decades,there are many C.C. players who
detest ANY opening book usage during a C.C. game,even a postal game from decades ago.
I have heard that story a thousand times over.I just smile at those who detest it,since I know that there is really nothing wrong with using any opening book,regardless of chess.com.
Perhaps that is why I am not ON chess.com and neither is many of my senior master friends.

TA

laurent_baptiste
22-Jan-25, 06:36

Let me clarify,

You can use opening books in chess.com, legally. But they are only allowed in Daily chess. Which is the same as GK's chess. They even have a database of sorts for Daily games which you can use - very similar to the GK version.

In Live chess, games that are completed in one sitting, for example bullet, blitz, rapid, no, it's not legal to use them.

I suspect the person OP mentioned used the opening books in Live chess games, and when asked about it confessed to be using them to make their first 10 moves or so. So they got their account banned. If such person had been playing Daily chess they would have not faced any punishments - the site itself offers a database for them to use.

euro_pop_legend
22-Jan-25, 06:37

Thanks Laurent....let me add...

Also,let me add to my above post.
While opinions may vary,using an opening book is NOT like using Stockfish,Rybka or any computer playing program.Stockfish and Hiarcs,for example are just "better" and more complete tools compared to GK's book or to a program that analyzes.So,for example,if Stockfish had NO opening book embedded in its program,then it would play without a book and of course,much weaker.
Its those who use a program to analyze the moves that are breaking the rules.Those who simply look at an opening book without using an analyzing program and a timer set to analyze with a program are ok.Books instantly generate opening moves,not analyze like a program and that IS the difference.Some books are longer than others,depending upon the opening style.I have played many on GK with a Ruy Lopez as white or black and my "book"has gone as long as 45+moves.Not all are accepted,but then a few opponents of mine have gone to about move #31.
After the book runs out,then I am on my own.

Again in OTB that is a totally different scenario as well as chess.com.
It depends on where you are playing.But never compare Stockfish to Hiarcs,or even GK's opening book.Hiarcs opening book is simply a more advanced tool than GK's opening book and thereare no time related analysis going on like in Shredder,Rybka or Stockfish.

laurent_baptiste
22-Jan-25, 06:38

And it's not just chess.com. Lichess rules are very similar in that aspect too. Disallowed for Live chess, but allowed for Correspondence (Daily) chess.

euro_pop_legend
22-Jan-25, 06:47

Hmmmm...thanks again laurent_baptiste.
Interesting enough even with Lichess,I think that has all changed.
I was with.... www.instantchess.com

and back then,it was NOT Lichess!Not that I can remember anyway.And the old rules never mentioned anything about NOT using opening databases.But then,the players were 98% blitz
which differed of course from long game C.C.

I had a top rating on Instantchess back then.Not even sure if my old account is still available.
Perhaps I will investigate some day.

TA

euro_pop_legend
22-Jan-25, 06:56

Yes.The Lichess board and website is COMPLETLY DIFFERENT than years ago!
I can remember Instantchess originating out of RUSSIA! They must have been bought out
by an American(?) business.I can also remember Instantchess having many other bells and whistles like being able to have the blitz search confined to only specific countries,that is,
if you wanted to play only someone from Norway,Germany ect ect!And you could also specifically narrow the playing field with ratings of your opponents.So,if you wanted to only play 1200-1500 rated,you could select that.

Wow,things have changed.I do not think Lichess is for me.

markb56
22-Jan-25, 13:19

I've said this before but it's worth repeating: Some of the games in the GK game database show computer analysis. I wish GK had a flag where you could turn off the visibility of the analysis, or if you own the game, be able to delete the analysis. I also wish that GK would update the database (which hasn't happened since Mike left).

chilliman64
22-Jan-25, 21:08

@pop_queen_legend

thank you for your detailed response

myrydin
06-Feb-25, 12:19

markb56 makes a good point, amongst others: when accessing the database, sometimes GK computer analysis is available. You should not view that analysis from a game in progress, because you would now be using the computer to help you make your move, which is against the rules. I think there should be a warning, or even better, for it not to be available other than for your own requests. I am happy to be corrected if wrong.

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