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 Conditional move max?My record is 27 as explained below in my old club post.The GK computer would not accept more than that.I did it as an experiment.Those who frown upon using any conditional moves may double frown when they see my report from the Deeper Chess Theory Club,which actually makes me smile: I always wondered what the maximum number of conditional moves was that a player could plug into a game at any point whether it was from move #1 or move #35,for example.Just recently I reset up a game that was drawn the first time around(rated game)and ask my opponent if they would like to play a second game BUT the same exact game from the last move where it was an agreed draw...and make this a rated game again.The player said ok.So,in order to do that I plugged in the game move for move right up to the point where it ended.I was actually able to plug in all 54 moves BUT the GK computer only accepted 27 of those conditional moves after I clicked on the submit button,and it did not accept the whole 54 moves or the entire game. Then after my opponent went through all of those conditional moves,I was able to plug in the other remaining 27 moves.So it appears to me that there is a limit on how many conditional moves the GK computer will program in for a player.And that number as far as I can determine is maxed out at 27 conditional moves in one "string" This is actually good to know,if you do want to set up a game again or playing a new game like,for example,a Ruy Lopez game where you can easily plug in 27 moves ahead of time in an opening that can easily go 30-40 and still be "in book". Now,its my understanding that you can plug in several conditional move strings or lines at one time as well...but I have never involved myself with that yet.I would be highly interested in anyone in or out of this club to discuss with me how that works or if they had any problems,ect ect. But in any case,the magic number appears to be 27! If anyone is ever able to plug in MORE than 27 conditional moves(that are accepted)by the GK computer...please let me know.I was only able to max the system out at 27.But if someone ever gets like 28-30 or more please let me know!Again my test revealed a max of 27,but I suppose that number might change in the future with upgrades,ect ect |
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euro_pop_legend 17-Sep-24, 16:31 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 17-Sep-24, 16:45.
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I agree,but pehaps it was somehow a GK limit enforced by GK outside of normal programing.I have no idea.All I can give you is what happened.I did a double which then gave it a round number of 54 to conditional move the rest of the game.You would think it would have allowed 28,but it did not.Now....that was at least 10 years ago,so again,things may have changed?That was the question.I could easily try it again one day from an opening position and move #1,but I am probably going to quit playing till next year after my last game right now.My memory is a bit foggy on my earliest games around 2005,but if I remember correctly,the amount of conditional moves you could plug in on GK in the early days of GK were much less than any number in the 20's!I think it was like 10 or so.Perhaps you remember? As to round numbers in programing,I just took a look at an old Shredder 10 Hash size option with a chess program before I posted this.In the hash tables,you can optionally select odd hash numbers in the engine parameters!I read somewhere that it was not suggested to do that for better engine strength and playability.But the key factor is,"it does exist" in programming as an odd number.I have no idea how that would affect the chess program to play,but if that was not recommended(and I know I read that several times over the years),then why in the first place did the programers allow it to begin with?Makes no sense to me.But then,I know as much about computers and programing as a Kindergarten kid knows how to solve differential equations. |
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 game Those were the good old days!I know back then you could not input mid 20's conditional move amounts,because I vaguely remember trying it and I believe it ended at 14 or so,maybe 10. Back then,I think that there were no options for additional move strings,that came later.You might confirm that. |
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Back in the early days(perhaps you remember?)...conditional moves were viewable at the BOTTOM of the GK gameboard and not as a separate Pop up window!I can vaguely remember GK saying that they did that to "save space".But are they really saving space with additional pop up windows?I have no idea. |
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luzhin657 18-Sep-24, 06:35 |
Interesting conditional move forum, but not very ethical exercise for your opponents!? Some may not agree but I am someone who was once a decent level chess player, now in retirement and only playing for pleasure I can appreciate everyone's love and struggles to try and achieve some success in our great game! |
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euro_pop_legend 18-Sep-24, 07:03 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 11-Oct-24, 11:54.
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euro_pop_legend 18-Sep-24, 08:42 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 18-Sep-24, 08:42.
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euro_pop_legend 18-Sep-24, 11:47 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 18-Sep-24, 12:08.
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euro_pop_legend 18-Sep-24, 12:08 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 11-Oct-24, 11:55.
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One final "hidden"thing about conditional moves.... Well,this will take much explaining and I am not running a club anymore,but let me try and condense the thoughts. Like others,I analyze many of the "history"of my opponents games before I challenge them or I accept their challenge to me.If I see for example,they had a tendency to win and use a Najdorf,then I know that more than likely they will use a ton of conditionals with the Najdorf in mind.So,the key would be to steer away from a Najdorf and right from the opening,go into something different that they did not expect like an early Alapin anti Sicilian.This can and will many times throw them off balance and not what they expected using the 12 conditional moves they sent me.So,you can learn from conditional moves and sometime,more the better! For example,you might see your opponent steering towards a closed game with his advance moves,then you simply disagree with the moves and change it to a more open game with your own moves,instead of waiting for his next expected conditional moves. In addition,another hidden advantage is that the subvariant style your opponent has used per conditional move can be closely analyzed as "best",average or inferior,WHEN you are STILL in book!Many opening books have long trees of variations and are color coded as to stat wins/losses and more.So,by seeing how your opponent is moving and knowing that his next move is probably 9...Be3(for example),you may want to change that ahead of time and looking at your book(like Hiarcs),change the flow and direction and go with a move that was won by a 2800 player,but on the "obscure side" and away from the main lines.So,more points on the conditional move line by your opponent can be his downfall....it all depends.If you go with the top main lines all the time,then among 2400+players,the game usually ends in a draw. I could write a book on this subject but I choose not to. So,conditional moves also have many hidden values,especially if you know the opponent is using them(from past experience with your opponent)and can be used as a weapon against them in future games.So,changing the flow,tides and eddies of some expected conditionals may run in your favor.It takes time and serious effort to look into,say 50 or more game wins and losses of my upcoming opponent to decide on my own which way I am going to proceed,no matter if he sends me 1 conditional or 25 conditionals! Conditional moves are only along for the ride whether you accept them or not.Never let yourself be disgruntled by those "if"moves.It may even run in your favor to use them or reject them....no biggie. |
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luzhin657 19-Sep-24, 01:30 |
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euro_pop_legend 19-Sep-24, 16:57 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 19-Sep-24, 17:24.
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euro_pop_legend 19-Sep-24, 17:24 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 11-Oct-24, 11:48.
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euro_pop_legend 19-Sep-24, 18:01 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 11-Oct-24, 11:48.
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euro_pop_legend 19-Sep-24, 19:10 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 11-Oct-24, 11:48.
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luzhin657 20-Sep-24, 04:47 |
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GameKnot Support |
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euro_pop_legend 11-Oct-24, 11:53 |
Deleted by euro_pop_legend on 11-Oct-24, 14:01.
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To GK... Thanks again GK.And nice to hear from you.Many of us thought there was no one here anymore to even tune into the forums. Regards, Gold Life member, TA |
